Joe Konrath first mentioned it last year, and I heard it again recently at Romantic Times. So I looked it up.
John Clute says: "UFs are normally texts where fantasy and the mundane world interact, intersect and interweave throughout a tale which is significantly about a real city."
Well, that would certainly fit The Tomb: mythological Hindu demons transported from India to NYC to fulfill a curse/vow, ancient magic necklaces with healing powers that allow two characters to live indefinitely. They intersect and interweave with Manhattan and with Jack who is the ghost in the city's urban machinery.
The first recognized urban fantasies are either Faerie by Ray Feist or War for the Oaks by Emma bull, both published after The Tomb.
So, yes, there's a case to be made but I'm not entirely comfortable with it.
What do you folks think?
John Clute says: "UFs are normally texts where fantasy and the mundane world interact, intersect and interweave throughout a tale which is significantly about a real city."
Well, that would certainly fit The Tomb: mythological Hindu demons transported from India to NYC to fulfill a curse/vow, ancient magic necklaces with healing powers that allow two characters to live indefinitely. They intersect and interweave with Manhattan and with Jack who is the ghost in the city's urban machinery.
The first recognized urban fantasies are either Faerie by Ray Feist or War for the Oaks by Emma bull, both published after The Tomb.
So, yes, there's a case to be made but I'm not entirely comfortable with it.
What do you folks think?
FPW
FAQ
"It means 'Ask the next question.' Ask the next question, and the one that follows that, and the one that follows that. It's the symbol of everything humanity has ever created." Theodore Sturgeon.
Personally I think that The Tomb would qualify under the criteria. However I think the term "fantasy" has a certain connotation which is not generally supported by your writing. It would qualify as fantasy according to definition but is much more fitting within the horror genre. When I think of fantasy I think of Elves and Faeries and such. There is nothing wrong with that and there is certainly an overlap between the two genres as the Lord of the Rings movies show very well. In short I'd prefer Urban Horror over Urban Fantasy.
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tenebroust Wrote:Personally I think that The Tomb would qualify under the criteria. However I think the term "fantasy" has a certain connotation which is not generally supported by your writing. It would qualify as fantasy according to definition but is much more fitting within the horror genre.
I agree with your assessment.
As for the first urban fantasy I'd say Moonheart by Charles De Lint, which was published in 1984(not sure if it beat The Tomb to the stands though), predates both of Konrath's suggestions and it is one of the best.
Scott
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Scott Miller Wrote:I agree with your assessment.
Also.
Otherwise, wouldn't some of the classic gothic horror novels (Dracula, Frankentein, etc.) qualify as Urban Fantasy? Didn't at least part of Dracula take place in London? :dontknow:
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cobalt79 Wrote:Ditto on that agreement. The Tomb is a Modern Urban Fantasy. I like the sound of it as well.So the Tomb is MUF?
Then Dracula and some of Lovecraft's work (Shadow over Innsmouth springs to mind) would be Classic Urban Fantasy (CUF)?
An interesting debate. I'm interested in learning more.
-Wapitikev
Axioms Jack seems to live by (inadvertantly or not):
Why he does what he does: "I chose this life. I know what I'm doing. And on any given day, I could stop doing it. Today, however, isn't that day. And tomorrow won't be either." Bruce Wayne, Identity Crisis
On Rasalom: "Water's wet, the sky is blue...and good old Satan Claus, Jimmy...he's out there...and he's just gettin' stronger." Joe Hallenbeck, The Last Boyscout
I always thought of The Tomb as a mix of urban noir and horror, but the supernatural, mythological nature of the rakoshi and the necklaces muddy the water.
Do the city and the fantasy world have to coexist? Is that the defining aspect of UF?
Do the city and the fantasy world have to coexist? Is that the defining aspect of UF?
FPW
FAQ
"It means 'Ask the next question.' Ask the next question, and the one that follows that, and the one that follows that. It's the symbol of everything humanity has ever created." Theodore Sturgeon.
fpw Wrote:I always thought of The Tomb as a mix of urban noir and horror, but the supernatural, mythological nature of the rakoshi and the necklaces muddy the water.From EVERYONE's favourite authoritative source, Wikipedia, the Urban Fantasy entry states:
Do the city and the fantasy world have to coexist? Is that the defining aspect of UF?
"The modern urban fantasy protagonist faces extraordinary circumstances as plots unfold in either open (where magic or paranormal events are commonly accepted to exist) or closed (where magical powers or creatures are concealed) worlds."
The Tomb definitely falls in the latter category...with emphasis on the horrific, lovecraftian-esque aspect of the supernatural.
Even more interested, now.
-Wapitikev
Axioms Jack seems to live by (inadvertantly or not):
Why he does what he does: "I chose this life. I know what I'm doing. And on any given day, I could stop doing it. Today, however, isn't that day. And tomorrow won't be either." Bruce Wayne, Identity Crisis
On Rasalom: "Water's wet, the sky is blue...and good old Satan Claus, Jimmy...he's out there...and he's just gettin' stronger." Joe Hallenbeck, The Last Boyscout
Quote:"The modern urban fantasy protagonist faces extraordinary circumstances as plots unfold in either open (where magic or paranormal events are commonly accepted to exist) or closed (where magical powers or creatures are concealed) worlds."
This is what I like so much about the RJ novels, which take the mundane of everyday life and throw in a lonewolf hero of sorts (Jack), the underlying supernatural aspect of good vs. evil, as well as a third, relatively nuetral antagonist, and mix it all up into one gigantic festive melting-pot.
I can read about what most mainstream authors write about these days in the newspaper, or watch it on CSI and Law & Order, it seems.