So I wasn't the only one who thought that FPW "mailed it in" on BTS, compared to Harbingers or even Bloodline.

Good to know.

I still have high hopes for Ground Zero, though.

Cheers, Bones.

-Wapitikev

Paul himself has acknowledged in the past that he refuses to write the character forever, hence the deadline (Nightworld) but he has a few more stories to tell before then.

I would not say it seemed as if he "mailed it in" with regards to BTS. It was great to see jack intricately tied to Black Wind which is my favorite novel of all time, by any author.

The novel was layered and complex and more than enough violence to hold my attention.

The slow build to the catastrophic events in NightWorld is like inching ever so slowly to the crest of a steep hill on a great rollercoaster. He is setting the events for the endgame when the reader will be taken down the steepest stomach dropping hill.

The style makes sense to me and makes me appricate night World all the more.

I read BTS immediately after BW. I certainly didn't feel that BTS seemed "phoned in" by comparison. In fact, I enjoyed it as a continuation of the same story. That wasn't my problem at all. In fact, I had no problem with BTS by itself. What problems I'm having are with all these wildly disparate plotlines that keep multiplying every couple of books or so and my fear that not all of them can be neatly wrapped up by the series conclusion.

It's gratifying to see that my mini-rant has, at least, inspired some good discussion.

Paul himself has acknowledged in the past that he refuses to write the character forever, hence the deadline (Nightworld) but he has a few more stories to tell before then.

I would not say it seemed as if he "mailed it in" with regards to BTS. It was great to see jack intricately tied to Black Wind which is my favorite novel of all time, by any author.

The novel was layered and complex and more than enough violence to hold my attention.

The slow build to the catastrophic events in NightWorld is like inching ever so slowly to the crest of a steep hill on a great rollercoaster. He is setting the events for the endgame when the reader will be taken down the steepest stomach dropping hill.

The style makes sense to me and makes me appricate night World all the more.

I agree Tony, the story was layered, complex, and did serve to pique my curiosity in some areas. I was intrigued by [spoiler]Glaeken's involvement, Gia's growing sensitivity to the Otherness, P. Frank Winslow, the sword staying with Jack despite the Lady's advice[/spoiler], and some others.

However, I found the main storyline (the convergence of all actors) to be far more predicatable (and a bit repetitous) and therefore less engaging, by comparison to past novels.

BTS was still better than most non-FPW novels I've read. And, unlike others, I do not compare it poorly to Black Wind; BW is not one of my top 10 FPW books either.

I have stated elsewhere on this board that one element I was particularly dissapointed in was the mellowing-down of the shoten to be anyone...not children only. This not only diminishes Black Wind by suggesting that the cult's failure to develop the Black Wind soon enough to win the war was due to incompetence (not experimenting enough with the elixir to discover that Children were not necessary), but also drastically reduces the horror of BTS's finale (for me) because Jack would have been forced to kill a child (or somehow render them unconcious)...only months after his unborn child was taken from him by the Ally. Naka Slater's grandchild as the shoten would have been an insteresting twist.

Now THAT would have made for some gut-wrenching character developemnt AND been horrific to read (as well as write, I am sure). As a father of a young child, I would have had nightmares about that one for weeks. As it stands, I easily dismissed the loss of a single adult whom I did not identify with to begin with.

Great literature, and particularly great horror literature, discusses what is hard to face; it doesn't take the easy way out.

As I said in that other thread, I may change my mind when I re-read it...I'm finishing Reborn now, so it will be a while...but until then, it remains one of my least favourite FPW books.

Just wanted to show that I did not make my comments lightly.

And thanks to Jim for offering a different option..."mailing it in" is more akin to what Stephen King does lately, with his novels..."phoned-in" or perhaps "emailed-in" is closer to how I felt about BTS.

-Wapitikev

Kev: I'll agree with you that the "watering down" (as you put it) of the shoten was a bit... well... I just didn't get it. It made no sense to me at all. Your discussion of it actually makes some kind of sense of it--[spoiler]FPW didn't want to have Jack kill a child.[/spoiler] I don't know if that was his actual rationale, but your explanation makes as much sense as any other explanation I can imagine.

And... it does seem like a cop out from that perspective. I can only hope that you're wrong in your reasoning.

Kev: I'll agree with you that the "watering down" (as you put it) of the shoten was a bit... well... I just didn't get it. It made no sense to me at all. Your discussion of it actually makes some kind of sense of it--[spoiler]FPW didn't want to have Jack kill a child.[/spoiler] I don't know if that was his actual rationale, but your explanation makes as much sense as any other explanation I can imagine.

And... it does seem like a cop out from that perspective. I can only hope that you're wrong in your reasoning.

Having expressed my dislike of some parts of BTS, I would also like to express how I feel about Paul as a writer.

In another thread I've thanked him for sharing ALL hard his hard work with us. He's written more amazing, consistently good horror novels than most if not all authors alive today.

Whatever he's satisfied with is his business and if I don't like it, I'll go and read somone else.

FPW's comments on why he changed the shoten can be found in this post...it seems clear that he discarded children solely as shoten due to discomfort with the cult rituals moreso that the possiblity that Jack may have to kill a child.

I respect his right to his convictions. I just think they made for a tamer story in BTS and, based on my imperfect understanding of the Otherness, "more comfortable" isn't what it is all about.

By the way, follow that other thread along...later on, FPW himself drops the bomb that he even considered but discarded having Vicky be the shoten...it's a good read.

-Wapitikev

I read BTS immediately after BW. I certainly didn't feel that BTS seemed "phoned in" by comparison. In fact, I enjoyed it as a continuation of the same story. That wasn't my problem at all. In fact, I had no problem with BTS by itself. What problems I'm having are with all these wildly disparate plotlines that keep multiplying every couple of books or so and my fear that not all of them can be neatly wrapped up by the series conclusion.

It's gratifying to see that my mini-rant has, at least, inspired some good discussion.

Damn it, Jim, he's a writer not a miracle worker!

Seriously, you have nothing to fear about the various storylines wrapping up neatly. Paul has said that he already has everything mapped out in general terms, so nothing to worry about there.

I agree Tony, the story was layered, complex, and did serve to pique my curiosity in some areas. I was intrigued by [spoiler]Glaeken's involvement, Gia's growing sensitivity to the Otherness, P. Frank Winslow, the sword staying with Jack despite the Lady's advice[/spoiler], and some others.

However, I found the main storyline (the convergence of all actors) to be far more predicatable (and a bit repetitous) and therefore less engaging, by comparison to past novels.

BTS was still better than most non-FPW novels I've read. And, unlike others, I do not compare it poorly to Black Wind; BW is not one of my top 10 FPW books either.

I have stated elsewhere on this board that one element I was particularly dissapointed in was the mellowing-down of the shoten to be anyone...not children only. This not only diminishes Black Wind by suggesting that the cult's failure to develop the Black Wind soon enough to win the war was due to incompetence (not experimenting enough with the elixir to discover that Children were not necessary), but also drastically reduces the horror of BTS's finale (for me) because Jack would have been forced to kill a child (or somehow render them unconcious)...only months after his unborn child was taken from him by the Ally. Naka Slater's grandchild as the shoten would have been an insteresting twist.

Now THAT would have made for some gut-wrenching character developemnt AND been horrific to read (as well as write, I am sure). As a father of a young child, I would have had nightmares about that one for weeks. As it stands, I easily dismissed the loss of a single adult whom I did not identify with to begin with.

Great literature, and particularly great horror literature, discusses what is hard to face; it doesn't take the easy way out.

As I said in that other thread, I may change my mind when I re-read it...I'm finishing Reborn now, so it will be a while...but until then, it remains one of my least favourite FPW books.

Just wanted to show that I did not make my comments lightly.

And thanks to Jim for offering a different option..."mailing it in" is more akin to what Stephen King does lately, with his novels..."phoned-in" or perhaps "emailed-in" is closer to how I felt about BTS.

-Wapitikev

You make some very compelling arguments, cuz. Compelling enough that now I'm inclined to agree with you about the shoten. Had the "children only" requirement remained, BTS certainly would have been more horrifying and gut-wrenching.

That said, I do not agree with the "phoned in" sentiments. I agree BTS doesn't pack the emotional wallop some of Paul's other novels do, but in a long series saga like the Repairman Jack novels a bit of pacing is acceptable - perhaps even necessary to avoid becoming cartoonish.

BTS is a pacer, a "bridge" novel, in an epic story arc. That's how I look at it anyway.

That said, I do not agree with the "phoned in" sentiments. I agree BTS doesn't pack the emotional wallop some of Paul's other novels do, but in a long series saga like the Repairman Jack novels a bit of pacing is acceptable - perhaps even necessary to avoid becoming cartoonish.

BTS is a pacer, a "bridge" novel, in an epic story arc. That's how I look at it anyway.

I'd rather have a phoned-in FPW book than any horror novel from any other author alive today...with the possible but unlikely exception for Brian Lumley's ongoing Cthulhu Mythos fiction.

-Wapitikev

Wap, you like Brian Lumley as well!? If I had my wish.....Harry Keogh and his "bits" would go on forever....although they probably do in the Mobius....lol

To be completely honest, I've never read any of the Necroscope stories...but as a fan, you likely know that Harry and the Pirates will be out some time in June 2009?

...more Harry sounds good...unless it's that Potter kid.

-Wapitikev