please stop reading if you have not read Harbingers yet. i want to start a discussion while it is still fresh in my mind, but i don't want to ruin it for anyone.
spoilers follow
OK, I think Harbingers is the best RJ novel since Gateways. I didn't really care for Infernal (didn't care for the plot, but it was still Jack and that made it a better read than 9/10ths of the stuff out there) and Crisscross was good, but not as good as the previous few. Harbingers was great (really, really great). It tied up some loose ends, explained some things in better depth, and made me think about the conflict of cosmic forces in a whole new way.
I love the fact that this book focuses on the Ally/Adversary conflict in such detail. In past novels we were always told that the Ally was opposed to evil, but not necessarily good. I always assumed this meant that the Ally was just kind of indifferent. The whole colored-glass discussion helped explain why the Ally is not as interested in us as the Adversary (though a creature that craves eating glass was a little too much of a stretch of the metaphor, I think). While the Ally wants human life on Earth, it does not concern itself with human morals (It might not even understand them). But now that we know that the Ally is behind killing Jack's family off and not the Otherness it puts a whole new take on what the Ally is. The Ally is not about morals. It is all about winning, and the means are not as important as the end. Makes me wonder what the Ally will do with Earth if he wins. Does he really just want to admire it?
This explains better why Mother (the Lady) wants to get rid of both the Ally and the Adversary. She is Mother Earth (implied as such, anyway), and has this planet's life in her best interests. She is pro-human life, while the Otherness is anti-human life. That makes her good in my book, but she might turn out to be manipulative in her own right. The whole 'Does anti-evil mean good?' question really gets put through the ringer here. I think some philosophy class could have a field day with this book.
Excellent book. I loved it. Only two small gripes. 1) Wow chips are not called Wow anymore. They got rebranded Light. But I'm not sure how long ago that happened... it might have occured after the book went to press. 2) Please, no more hackers that have some code he wrote that can crack 128-bit encryption. Using 128-bit encryption there are 2^128 possible combinations. I've read that trying every possible combination would take longer to crack than waiting for the Universe to eventually implode.
One question/obseration: Do you think Glaeken's wife has Alzheimer's to make him a better spear? It would seem to fit with what we now know about the Ally. I wonder if any of this new info about the Ally/Heir/Sentinel was added to the new Nightworld.
spoilers follow
OK, I think Harbingers is the best RJ novel since Gateways. I didn't really care for Infernal (didn't care for the plot, but it was still Jack and that made it a better read than 9/10ths of the stuff out there) and Crisscross was good, but not as good as the previous few. Harbingers was great (really, really great). It tied up some loose ends, explained some things in better depth, and made me think about the conflict of cosmic forces in a whole new way.
I love the fact that this book focuses on the Ally/Adversary conflict in such detail. In past novels we were always told that the Ally was opposed to evil, but not necessarily good. I always assumed this meant that the Ally was just kind of indifferent. The whole colored-glass discussion helped explain why the Ally is not as interested in us as the Adversary (though a creature that craves eating glass was a little too much of a stretch of the metaphor, I think). While the Ally wants human life on Earth, it does not concern itself with human morals (It might not even understand them). But now that we know that the Ally is behind killing Jack's family off and not the Otherness it puts a whole new take on what the Ally is. The Ally is not about morals. It is all about winning, and the means are not as important as the end. Makes me wonder what the Ally will do with Earth if he wins. Does he really just want to admire it?
This explains better why Mother (the Lady) wants to get rid of both the Ally and the Adversary. She is Mother Earth (implied as such, anyway), and has this planet's life in her best interests. She is pro-human life, while the Otherness is anti-human life. That makes her good in my book, but she might turn out to be manipulative in her own right. The whole 'Does anti-evil mean good?' question really gets put through the ringer here. I think some philosophy class could have a field day with this book.
Excellent book. I loved it. Only two small gripes. 1) Wow chips are not called Wow anymore. They got rebranded Light. But I'm not sure how long ago that happened... it might have occured after the book went to press. 2) Please, no more hackers that have some code he wrote that can crack 128-bit encryption. Using 128-bit encryption there are 2^128 possible combinations. I've read that trying every possible combination would take longer to crack than waiting for the Universe to eventually implode.
One question/obseration: Do you think Glaeken's wife has Alzheimer's to make him a better spear? It would seem to fit with what we now know about the Ally. I wonder if any of this new info about the Ally/Heir/Sentinel was added to the new Nightworld.
Viscount Radu Wrote:please stop reading if you have not read Harbingers yet. i want to start a discussion while it is still fresh in my mind, but i don't want to ruin it for anyone.What I find interesting is the implication that it isn't human sentience that makes our world into "colored seaglass", but the sentience of The Lady! The whole plot to convince the Ally that the world is "dead", making it lose interest, revolves around killing her. Are there universes out there that we would consider inhabited by sentient life that the Ally would not, because they have nothing like The Lady? It seems clear that humanity would survive her passing, but could we have arisen without her? Are we just a "side effect" of her sentience?
This explains better why Mother (the Lady) wants to get rid of both the Ally and the Adversary. <snip> I think some philosophy class could have a field day with this book.
Quote:I wonder if any of this new info about the Ally/Heir/Sentinel was added to the new Nightworld.I don't see how FPW could have avoided adding it. The original meeting between Jack and Glaeken just makes no sense given the present state of Jack's knowledge. But, Jack also seems to be without an excuse now for delaying working with Glaeken until he has proof of the Ally/Adversary conflict. Yet, if Jack does hook up with Glaeken right away, then he can get his part of the job done long before there is any real danger. So, he must have another excuse for delaying until Rasalom's plan is in gear. I thought at first that his anger at the Ally would provide that excuse, but Jack seems to have admitted already that he has no real choice -- he can't work for the Otherness, and he can't stay out of it. Can't wait for my copy of the revised Nightworld to see how this is handled!
Brett
*SLMW 1.0* No animals were harmed in the production of this message.
Viscount Radu Wrote:Makes me wonder what the Ally will do with Earth if he wins. Does he really just want to admire it?
Interesting pronoun choice! I've always thought of the Ally and the Otherness as essentially genderless, but you bring up an interesting contrast with the Lady, who clearly has a defined gender. Implications?
Viscount Radu Wrote:She is Mother Earth (implied as such, anyway)
Very interesting take. I hadn't thought of it quite that way.
Viscount Radu Wrote:Only two small gripes. 1) Wow chips are not called Wow anymore. They got rebranded Light.
I have to admit that I didn't even realize they were still around in any form! I will now take the mature route and avoid any "No shit!" jokes.
Viscount Radu Wrote:2) Please, no more hackers that have some code he wrote that can crack 128-bit encryption.
You've got a good point there. Here are some links describing what you're talking about:
http://www.inet2000.com/public/encryption.htm
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=255635
http://phark.typepad.com/phark/2004/09/r...ption.html
However, all of that implies a brute force attack. If there's a flaw in the implementation of the encryption, it may be possible to break it without resorting to doing it "the long way". (I have three letters for you: WEP.)
Without being a security expert (I think I'd like to go for a CISSP certification in the next year or two), I still think I can come up with a scenario where the file could be cracked. For example, what if it was encrypted with a program that came on the flash drive, and that program has a known weakness to exploit? For example, maybe a flaw in the software causes it to use only certain patterns of keys, thus dramatically reducing the number of possible combinations to try. It would be a bit like having a combination lock with five digits and only having to find one.
Sound plausible? Anyone else with thoughts on this?
Viscount Radu Wrote:One question/obseration: Do you think Glaeken's wife has Alzheimer's to make him a better spear?
I don't think so. I think his wife was left alone when Glaeken was made mortal.
Blake
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Blake Wrote:For example, what if it was encrypted with a program that came on the flash drive, and that program has a known weakness to exploit?
I found an article here that supports what I was saying above. The number of bits becomes a lot less important when the encryption algorithm is flawed. As an example, it mentions a product here that specializes in password recovery of encrypted application files. Interesting stuff. I don't think the Harbingers scenario is so implausible after all.
Blake
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cobalt79 Wrote:I've just finished Harbingers. No spoilers from me.....yet. Let's have some of our fellow board members finish, then the discussin' can begin. All I'm gonna say for now...............is WOW! (No pun intended.) FPW sir, please write faster!
I just finished tonight as well....and was blown away. Like Colbalt, I'll wait for other people to catch up before I say anything too much. Besides, this will give me a chance to start reading it over again!
Thanks for the wonderful thrill ride (and emotional roller coaster), F. Paul!
-Luthie
P.S.
LOL at the "WOW", Cobalt.
cobalt79 Wrote:I've just finished Harbingers. No spoilers from me.....yet. Let's have some of our fellow board members finish, then the discussin' can begin. All I'm gonna say for now...............is WOW! (No pun intended.) FPW sir, please write faster!
Time to play Harbingers discussions yet?
-Luthie
Blake Wrote:I found an article here that supports what I was saying above. The number of bits becomes a lot less important when the encryption algorithm is flawed.
Here are some more links:
http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,119483,00.asp
http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-3513_7-5662635-1.html
http://www.elcomsoft.com/aopr.html
Sorry to keep harping on the topic, but I'm finding the information interesting!
Blake
Please support Friends of Washoe.
cobalt79 Wrote:Sure! We can start off with your impression of the sunglasses. Easy topic with not alot of spoilers!!!
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Not too many thoughts on the glasses other than these minors ones:
1) They're pretty cool.
2) Interesting tie in to the Twins. And now we know why The Twins never took their glasses off.
3) Love the whole sub-plot with the Florida MV assassin and Jack figuring out something was astray by finding an identical pair of glasses.
And let the fun discussions begin.
-Luthie