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Question for the Hitmen - fpw - 06-27-2005

Any suggestions for a small-caliber semi-auto (.22 maybe?) pistol for close-up kills that can be fitted with a suppressor? (And not the P-98 used in ATR).

Question for the Hitmen - Bluesman Mike Lindner - 06-27-2005

fpw Wrote:Any suggestions for a small-caliber (.22 maybe?) pistol for close-up kills that can be fitted with a suppressor? (And not the P-98 used in ATR).

"Question for the hitmen," Paul? "You have the right to remain silent..." Wink

Question for the Hitmen - jaybird - 06-27-2005

Oh Great One, one choice could be the Ruger 22/45 Mark III. It is mainly used for target shooting but, it uses 22 magnum rounds. At close range, using hollow-point magnum rounds, it can make quite a mess. To top it off the barrel is thick enough to support a silencer. Also, a 1911 model framed pistol can be changed from a .45 caliber to a .22 caliber with a conversion kit quite easily. This model of pistol also supports silencer capabilities. The only drawback is that it is a large frame pistol, thus more of a problem to conceal/carry. Wink

Question for the Hitmen - jaybird - 06-27-2005

jaybird Wrote:Oh Great One, one choice could be the Ruger 22/45 Mark III. It is mainly used for target shooting but, it uses 22 magnum rounds. At close range, using hollow-point magnum rounds, it can make quite a mess. To top it off the barrel is thick enough to support a silencer. Also, a 1911 model framed pistol can be changed from a .45 caliber to a .22 caliber with a conversion kit quite easily. This model of pistol also supports silencer capabilities. The only drawback is that it is a large frame pistol, thus more of a problem to conceal/carry. Wink
You can never have to much firepower!!!

Question for the Hitmen - Biggles - 06-27-2005

fpw Wrote:Any suggestions for a small-caliber semi-auto (.22 maybe?) pistol for close-up kills that can be fitted with a suppressor? (And not the P-98 used in ATR).

A Walther PPK (or clone) fitted with a threaded barrel (available as an after market accessory). The PPK was made in .22LR, .32ACP (7.65mm), and .380ACP (9mm Kurz), all of which are subsonic and easily suppressed. Plus, since the PPK is DA/SA, restriking a hard primer or pulling the hammer back to lighten the first shot trigger pull are both viable options. Finally, the PP/PPK series is very accurate for a pocket pistol. I qualified expert with a PP on the police qualification course on the first try (246/250).

If you want to go just a bit bigger, I would use an East German Makarov in 9mm Mak. The bullet is just subsonic, as powerful as you can go in a blowback pistol, threaded barrels are easily obtained, and the DA pull is far smoother and lighter than the PP/PPK.
http://www.makarov.com/graphics/thrdbarl.jpg
Finally, the Mak is so accurate that I don't even practice torso shots any more, only head shots. My Mak would be my weapon of choice for any hit. For that matter, I believe that Magsafe and Glaser both make frangibles for it, and if they don't, you can swap out barrels to convert it to .380ACP.

Just my opinion. I've never ACTUALLY whacked anybody (yet). Big Grin

Question for the Hitmen - Biggles - 06-27-2005

jaybird Wrote:Oh Great One, one choice could be the Ruger 22/45 Mark III. It is mainly used for target shooting but, it uses 22 magnum rounds. At close range, using hollow-point magnum rounds, it can make quite a mess. To top it off the barrel is thick enough to support a silencer. Also, a 1911 model framed pistol can be changed from a .45 caliber to a .22 caliber with a conversion kit quite easily. This model of pistol also supports silencer capabilities. The only drawback is that it is a large frame pistol, thus more of a problem to conceal/carry. Wink

The .22 Magnum (.22 WMR) is supersonic, so suppression is less effective.

http://www.winchester.com/products/catalog/rimfiredetail.aspx?symbol=S22WM&cart=MjIgV2luY2hlc3RlciBNYWdudW0=

Question for the Hitmen - Biggles - 06-27-2005

Bluesman Mike Lindner Wrote:"Question for the hitmen," Paul? "You have the right to remain silent..." Wink

Well, he could be referring to musical hits. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it. Fagedaboudit.

Question for the Hitmen - law dawg - 06-28-2005

fpw Wrote:Any suggestions for a small-caliber semi-auto (.22 maybe?) pistol for close-up kills that can be fitted with a suppressor? (And not the P-98 used in ATR).
Since you are going to be supressing the shot it will, by definition, be slower, so you would probably want to compensate by having a heavier bullet. That is essentially the argument between, say, a 9mm vs. a .45. A 9 is a light bullet moving very fast while a .45 is a heavier bullet moving more slowly. If you use a supressed light bullet then you have a slow, light bullet, minimizing the damage to the "client" (trying to get into the role here....Wink) It helps to think of a bullet as essentially a rock that is thrown very, very fast. If you have a light one, to do enough damage you must throw it harder than a heavier one.

All that to say, since you are using a small caliber, I'd do with the heaviest round you can find. A .380 would probably do the trick in my BS opinion. A 9mm is getting into the "big boy" rounds, but also viable.

Question though : what is the purpose of the small caliber? Is it for concealment purposes (small size) or some kind of calling card ("I am so good I can whack you with a teeny-tiny pistol") or what? It makes a difference because, as you know, you can get a big caliber in small sizes these days....

Question for the Hitmen - fpw - 06-28-2005

law dawg Wrote:Question though : what is the purpose of the small caliber? Is it for concealment purposes (small size) or some kind of calling card ("I am so good I can whack you with a teeny-tiny pistol") or what? It makes a difference because, as you know, you can get a big caliber in small sizes these days....

Apparently (I've read) the signature mob hit is two .22s behind the ear.

Question for the Hitmen - law dawg - 06-28-2005

fpw Wrote:Apparently (I've read) the signature mob hit is two .22s behind the ear.
Aha. I've read and heard the same thing but have never worked Mob stuff so don't really know. I trust your Jersey boy info better than my southern guess...Wink My personal opinion is they are idiots if they use such a caliber. Elan has no place in this kind of wetwork.

BTW, if you can get your hands on a copy (out of print) of the book Killer by Joey (pseudonym), it is like a how-to book for Mob operations. Joey was a button man for the Mob and each chapter gives a how-to aspect of Mob operations - shylocking, numbers, and, Joey's specialty, killing. His preference was a .38 or .357. He would even do it in public view and he explains why it worked. It is an interesting read and then some. I got my copy on Amazon after I loaned my first copy out and it never came back some years ago.....Sad

PS-Just looked it up on Amazon and it has been re-released under a new title and is pretty cheap : http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1560253932/qid=1119972739/sr=2-3/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_3/103-8572729-4314232