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+--- Thread: Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! (/thread-952.html)
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - jimbow8 - 05-27-2005
Blake Wrote:Yes, but how does Vader know that?Ok, good point.
Blake
Maybe just in the fact that Obi-Wan came to Mustafar. Sure he came to kill him, but the fact that Obi-Wan was so torn up about it indicates that he still had some hope inside of him somewhere. IMO. He could have killed him, but he didn't. It seems obvious to me that Obi-Wan is really conflicted inside, and this indicates to me that he still clings to the goodness that he at least wants to see in Vader.
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Marc - 05-27-2005
Blake Wrote:It doesn't say that at all. It's a voiceover; that's what the "(V.O.)" means. You were never going to see Qui-Gon. And again, the key line is "Perhaps in time, even your physical self." Qui-Gon didn't learn to take his physical self with him, so we only hear him; we don't see him.
I'm familiar with V.O. (screenwriter here
) and I did some research after you mentioned this Yoda scene. A lot of people seen to think that in the movie (not the book) that Qui-Gon actually appeared to Yoda. Granted, we won't know for sure unless the deleted scene is included on the DVD. Quote:Lucas has been quoted somewhere as saying that Anakin's body disappeared off-screen at death, but I'll have to dig around to find it now....
If it's not in the movie then it doesn't matter what he says. We, as an audience, need to see it, not here it after the fact. What I see: Anakin dies then cremated. If his body is suppose to disappear then show it, don't tell me in a commentary track.
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Jay #1 - 05-27-2005
It could also be that with Anakin lying there without any means to defend himself, Obi-Wan as Jedi, could not attack him. With Palpatine, he still had full capability to do something... so Windu was in full right to take him out.
Of course.... there is the fact that even in the heat of battle, Obi-Wan as master of Anakin, still tried to warn him that he would leave himself open if Anakin leaped up.
jimbow8 Wrote:Ok, good point.
Maybe just in the fact that Obi-Wan came to Mustafar. Sure he came to kill him, but the fact that Obi-Wan was so torn up about it indicates that he still had some hope inside of him somewhere. IMO. He could have killed him, but he didn't. It seems obvious to me that Obi-Wan is really conflicted inside, and this indicates to me that he still clings to the goodness that he at least wants to see in Vader.
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - jimbow8 - 05-27-2005
Marc B. Wrote:I'm familiar with V.O. (screenwriter hereSimilarly, use your second argument for the issue with the deleted scene. It didn't appear in the movie, so it doesn't happen.
If it's not in the movie then it doesn't matter what he says. We, as an audience, need to see it, not here it after the fact. What I see: Anakin dies then cremated. If his body is suppose to disappear then show it, don't tell me in a commentary track.
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Marc - 05-27-2005
jimbow8 Wrote:Similarly, use your second argument for the issue with the deleted scene. It didn't appear in the movie, so it doesn't happen.
If the deleted scene is put back into the movie at the time of a DVD release then it's a moot point.
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Annice Burdeos - 05-27-2005
Maggers Wrote:You got your words and mine mixed up in the previous post.
Your statement:
sounded to me like a belittling of "little" films, smaller budget, more personal, formerly-known-as-"art" films, which I very much enjoy, even though such films may not be seen by very many people.
Here follows an obvious statement which surely you must know: the number of people to see a film has no bearing on the quality of the film.
Some of the best films I have ever seen- Careful, He Might Hear You, Vigil and Yol have had very few people seeing them.
Yes I am aware of such but the bottom line is putting butts in the seats.
Even independents adhere to that maxim
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Maggers - 05-27-2005
Annice Burdeos Wrote:...
Yes I am aware of such but the bottom line is putting butts in the seats.
Even independents adhere to that maxim
Too true. But when it comes to compiling my lists of best and worst, the only butt that counts is my rather generous one.
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Blake - 05-27-2005
Marc B. Wrote:If it's not in the movie then it doesn't matter what he says. We, as an audience, need to see it, not here it after the fact. What I see: Anakin dies then cremated. If his body is suppose to disappear then show it, don't tell me in a commentary track.
Well, it may be a moot point anyway. I can't find the quote!
I did find reference to Anakin supposedly disappearing in the Special Edition Return of the Jedi script, but I don't have it handy to check -- not that it would matter since it's not, as you say, in the film itself.For the sake of argument, we could assume that Anakin did not disappear and that he's still able to become a "ghost" because he's the Chosen One and finally fulfilled the prophecy by destroying the Sith and bringing balance to the Force.
I would point out, though, that George Lucas has never spoonfed his audience. There are all kinds of things that don't really get explained completely (if at all), even in the original trilogy. Example: How did Vader find out who blew up the Death Star between Episodes IV and V? Why did he become so obsessed with finding Luke? Did he figure out it was his kid? And how does that tie into the scene where Vader talks to the Emperor in TESB? Vader seems surprised to find Luke is his son in that scene (DVD version). Is he genuinely surprised? Faking because he plans to try to overthrow the Emperor with Luke? None of these things are really answered, though there probably is an answer. We're just expected to fill in those gaps ourselves. (I have thoughts on the matter, but it's mostly speculation.)
Blake
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Jay #1 - 05-27-2005
Actually, I thought Vader was extremely ticked at Han Solo for causing his star fighter to fly off into the vacuum in New Hope. Hence why he was obsessed with getting a hold of the Falcon.
As for how he knew about Luke... well, I think that if he felt someone using The Force, he'd probably recognize the feeling again. Then when the emporer told him, it confirmed things. Besides, I would think that during those years in the empire's service, that Vader figured out he either didn't kill Padme, or part of the vision where Obi-Wan helped her as she died might have actually been her dying after the child was born.
Of course, I could also be reading too much into this.
Blake Wrote:Example: How did Vader find out who blew up the Death Star between Episodes IV and V? Why did he become so obsessed with finding Luke? Did he figure out it was his kid? And how does that tie into the scene where Vader talks to the Emperor in TESB? Vader seems surprised to find Luke is his son in that scene (DVD version). Is he genuinely surprised? Faking because he plans to try to overthrow the Emperor with Luke? None of these things are really answered, though there probably is an answer. We're just expected to fill in those gaps ourselves. (I have thoughts on the matter, but it's mostly speculation.)
Blake
Revenge of the Sith WITH SPOILERS!! - Marc - 05-27-2005
Blake Wrote:I would point out, though, that George Lucas has never spoonfed his audience.
No offense, but we saw the same series, yes? The original trilogy may not be spoon-feeding as much, but the new trilogy is loaded with spoon-feeding.
Quote:There are all kinds of things that don't really get explained completely (if at all), even in the original trilogy.
I just wrote this off as Lucas trying to make entertaining films inspired by his years growing up. Certain things can be thrown out without an explanation because people will be entertained. I assumed this is what he did.